Old MGB Performances from Much

[daniel_v]

Just recently saw this interview of Matt and Raine where they got to tour the archives of the old Much Music headquarters and watch some of their old performances.
 

Then I got jealous and got thinking about how those greedy bastards (Bell Media, not Matt and Raine, obviously) have been hoarding those things for decades. I've contacted them in the past but I believe that was before Youtube even existed (or at least before it really took off). As such I took the liberty of sending questions again about them on Twitter( https://twitter.com/Much) and through e-mail at "[email protected]"

I have no idea who owns the rights to those performances (probably Bell though since they bought Much Music to my understanding) or what hoops would have to be jumped through to get the videos released, but I figured it can't hurt to have extra people looking into it so I thought I'd make this thread up in case anyone wanted to help out. 

So yeah, if you do make any inquires and get any answers back, please feel free to share them here.

Thanks, folks. Edited February 3, 2018 by daniel_v

[Stwlegend]

Just recently saw this interview of Matt and Raine where they got to tour the archives of the old Much Music headquarters and watch some of their old performances.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRGO7k4OH8E

 

Then I got jealous and got thinking about how those greedy bastards (Bell Media, not Matt and Raine, obviously) have been hoarding those things for decades. I've contacted them in the past but I believe that was before Youtube even existed (or at least before it really took off). As such I took the liberty of sending questions again about them on Twitter( https://twitter.com/Much) and through e-mail at "[email protected]"

 

I have no idea who owns the rights to those performances (probably Bell though since they bought Much Music to my understanding) or what hoops would have to be jumped through to get the videos released, but I figured it can't hurt to have extra people looking into it so I thought I'd make this thread up in case anyone wanted to help out. 

 

So yea, if you do make an inquires and get any answers back, please feel free to share them here.

 

Thanks, folks. 

 

 

Wow that archive footage looks good, just from the short bits they show.  Thanks for the link, didn't catch this interview.  Gonna throw them an email too for the hell of it. I'm pretty sure a lot of people on here have tried in multiple ways to get the attention of them without luck, but doesn't hurt to send.  Such a shame for that all to be locked up.

Edited February 3, 2018 by Stwlegend

[daniel_v]

Yeah, the 96 performance would be incredible to see given how early in their career they were (not to mention they play an unreleased song from LOTGA), and apparently, according to the clip from the above interview, they also did a performance in 98 there too just after Underdogs was released. It would be pretty cool to get to see OLP do one of their first live televised performances too. 

And thanks for taking the time to send off the e-mail, btw. If you get anything back other than the automated reply definitely let me know. I just got this as an automated response:
 

"Thanks for contacting Much.

If you have a general question, please check out our FAQ page here: http://www.much.ca/aboutus

 

To find out when your favourite show is airing, click here: http://www.much.com/schedule/

We always appreciate your comments, suggestions and concerns. We’ll try our best to respond, but aren’t able to get back to everyone. Please be assured that your feedback will be shared with our team.

Follow Much on Twitter: @Much https://twitter.com/much"

I also made some calls to the 299 Queen St West building (formally the Chum Hum Much Music Music Headquarters) and even a Bell Media building in Vancouver to try and get some other contact numbers when there was no answer at the 299 building. Unfortunately the alternate contact numbers I got were both out of service. 

Would anyone who is going to the VIP parts of the tour maybe be willing to ask Matt or Raine if they know of anyone who might be good to talk to from there? 

I've already contacted Ed the Sock on Facebook too. No idea if he'll get back to me but we have talked in the past after I donated to his channel last year. 

Edited February 3, 2018 by daniel_v

[daniel_v]

Shit....

 

Ed the Sock sent this message back to me.

Sounds kind of ominous.

[adam_777]

I've never really understood the cloak and dagger approach they take with this.  They've determined Canadians want reality TV on their music stations instead of music.  But why just sit on that massive archive doing nothing? Do they think there is some big cash in down the road? Alot of those bands are already long forgotten and interest in them has long slowed to a trickle of fans.  Even someone like Matt Good who was selling 200,000+ copies of his records in this country probably has a dedicated fan base of 5000 or less who might consider paying for these archival releases.  And before anyone says something like 40,000 people come to his shows each tour, ask yourself, how many of those people would buy an archival release of MG or MGB product.  A good chunk of those fans still actually think they are seeing MGB 17 years after they broke up! 

Look at Elvis Presley, if you were to define what a pop culture icon is Elvis has to be at the top of the heap.  Is there anyone living in North America who has never heard of Elvis? But even so, his popularity is rapidly declining.  Memorabilia prices are dropping and young kids for the most part are totally uninterested in buying his films or records.  As his aging fan base starts to reach the age where their health becomes more important than their record collections, the King is suddenly losing some of that shine on his crown.  Most of the bands featured in Much's archive have already seen their popularity seriously wane or completely vanish.  I just don't see that archive being some big massive paycheck for Bell. Meanwhile they are paying costs to store it all year after year with basically zero revenue coming in on it, because who is even licensing this stuff? When was the last time you saw a contemporary doc on any canadian group not named the Tragically Hip? 

The only approach that makes any sense would be a subscription based service with access to the entire archive, but that is a huge undertaking to digitize and host all that media on a server and run a subscription based model, that quite frankly I can't see more than a few thousand people paying for.  If it were me, I'd crowd fund it.  I'd set up a simple webpage, with a master list sorted by each band of what exists in the archive and then a projected cost for what each item would cost to individually be digitized and setup for either a physical release or a digital download.  Then run fund raising campaigns.  Obviously the material that won't be profitable won't be released and the material that is will be.  That's the only way I can see to maximize profits while seriously minimizing losses and the material the fans most desire can get out there to the remaining fans that want it and Bell can see some financial turn around on the archives.  Unfortunately that means alot of material wouldn't be able to be funded due to lack of interest, but such is the business world, at least it'd be better than the current system where all of it is essentially lost to the public and Bell sees diminished returns on it every year as they continue to pay storage fees on an investment that is decreasing in popularity and financial worth.   

[Guest girl]

I love Ed the Sock.

 

Maybe Much Music can donate their archive to the University of Calgary, much like Universal Music Canada did with the EMI Music Canada Archive. The U of C received a $1.5M grant from The Andrew W. Mellon Foundation for a three-year media migration and digitization project.

 

https://www.ucalgary.ca/utoday/issue/2017-10-05/15m-grant-andrew-w-mellon-foundation-supports-urgently-needed-research-media

[adam_777]

I love Ed the Sock.

 

Maybe Much Music can donate their archive to the University of Calgary, much like Universal Music Canada did with the EMI Music Canada Archive. The U of C received a $1.5M grant from The Andrew W. Mellon Foundation for a three-year media migration and digitization project.

 

https://www.ucalgary.ca/utoday/issue/2017-10-05/15m-grant-andrew-w-mellon-foundation-supports-urgently-needed-research-media

That would be a good idea if they dont think they can do anything with it financially.  But I always find these universities when they get these archives are always slightly cagey about them.  It usually takes a great deal of time for them to make it accessible and when they do, it always seems like they aren't very transparent about what they have.  An example, the Denver Public Library obtained the entire archives of the former Rocky Mountain News archive.  This was the main paper for the american west from frontier days until the early 2000's.  I went to view the photo archives, expecting an entire room of photo prints and photo negatives, I was handed a box the size of a small briefcase and told this was all that there was from over 150 years where several staff photographers would have taken photos every day of the week.  Obviously there must have been much much more, but they were claiming for some unknown reason that was all they had.  Those are the kinds of things that frustrate me and always worry me about these kind of donations, is the public is rarely made fully aware of what was contained in the donation which creates situations where stuff deemed unusable can be disposed of, or stuff of some financial value can be pilfered by employees.  

[Stwlegend]

Shit....

 

Ed the Sock sent this message back to me.

 

Sounds kind of ominous.

Thanks for sharing that. Not sure if that means they have plans to one day do something with it but just not now as it's too nostalgic, or if that means plans to destroy it lol. Do Raine/Matt have a say in that footage or is it all Much Music I wonder. Seems like neither want anything to do with it right now anyway which sucks for all of us. Edited February 4, 2018 by Stwlegend

[daniel_v]

Thanks for sharing that. Not sure if that means they have plans to one day do something with it but just not now as it's too nostalgic, or if that means plans to destroy it lol. Do Raine/Matt have a say in that footage or is it all Much Music I wonder. Seems like neither want anything to do with it right now anyway which sucks for all of us.

Well, yeah the first half might have made me think they were going to release it eventually, but then the second half made me think he meant they're thinking of getting rid of it (especially given the point Adam_777 made about storage space costing money). Then again though, they own the entire building so it's not like getting rid of any of it would save them money unless they planned to rent/lease the space to another business...

 

One way or another though I would assume the longer it sits though I would imagine the more the quality will degrade so either way the more they're pushed to release sooner the better in my opinion.

 

I love Ed the Sock.

 

Maybe Much Music can donate their archive to the University of Calgary, much like Universal Music Canada did with the EMI Music Canada Archive. The U of C received a $1.5M grant from The Andrew W. Mellon Foundation for a three-year media migration and digitization project.

 

https://www.ucalgary.ca/utoday/issue/2017-10-05/15m-grant-andrew-w-mellon-foundation-supports-urgently-needed-research-media

Well that's an idea at the very least. Nothing wrong with a model that's already been tried. Thanks for sharing that Girl :)

 

 

 

The only approach that makes any sense would be a subscription based service with access to the entire archive, but that is a huge undertaking to digitize and host all that media on a server and run a subscription based model, that quite frankly I can't see more than a few thousand people paying for.  If it were me, I'd crowd fund it.  I'd set up a simple webpage, with a master list sorted by each band of what exists in the archive and then a projected cost for what each item would cost to individually be digitized and setup for either a physical release or a digital download.  Then run fund raising campaigns.  Obviously the material that won't be profitable won't be released and the material that is will be.  That's the only way I can see to maximize profits while seriously minimizing losses and the material the fans most desire can get out there to the remaining fans that want it and Bell can see some financial turn around on the archives.  Unfortunately that means alot of material wouldn't be able to be funded due to lack of interest, but such is the business world, at least it'd be better than the current system where all of it is essentially lost to the public and Bell sees diminished returns on it every year as they continue to pay storage fees on an investment that is decreasing in popularity and financial worth.   

How exactly does one undertake the process of digitizing from VHS anyways and what costs would be associated? I think the crowd funding idea is the most logical and straightforward way provided you could actually get a hold of someone at Bell to liaison with on the issue.  

[Guest girl]

I recorded some Much Music/MuchMoreMusic Matthew Good footage on VHS tape in the early 2000's. The quality deteriorated, so I copied them to DVDs using a DVD recorder/VHS VCR combo.

In a dream world, if someone at University of Calgary taught me how to digitize it properly and if Much Music was going to going to discard this footage anyways, I'd be more than happy to volunteer and do it for free.

[adam_777]

I recorded some Much Music/MuchMoreMusic Matthew Good footage on VHS tape in the early 2000's. The quality deteriorated, so I copied them to DVDs using a DVD recorder/VHS VCR combo.

In a dream world, if someone at University of Calgary taught me how to digitize it properly and if Much Music was going to going to discard this footage anyways, I'd be more than happy to volunteer and do it for free.

Im with you, I can digitize in the same manner which is the easiest way to make a digital copy of the material.  I suspect most of this is sourced on VHS and Beta tapes, which means the quality would be limited to about 240P digitizing it wouldn't increase that.  I doubt much of this footage exists on film, which is what is needed for the serious HD upgrades and that sort of thing.  You can bake tapes and do all sorts of other things to enhance them, but lets be honest about it, none of these bands are The Beatles, and for Bell the juice wouldnt be worth the squeeze to really go all out trying to restore the footage.  But like Girl, I'd gladly volunteer time to do this to restore and digitize this footage before it degrades away or is disposed of.  I'd love just to see a list of what they have for Matt, Much was pretty much just following him around for a couple years there.  If you watch the MMM Bio, you see little snippets of 10-30 seconds of footage all from MG's career.  You can bet much more intensive and complete footage from those concerts existed than those few clips used in the the doc, and there is footage from pretty much all eras of MGB and some early MG solo footage.  For people like us, it'd be a real treasure trove.  

[Stwlegend]

Im with you, I can digitize in the same manner which is the easiest way to make a digital copy of the material.  I suspect most of this is sourced on VHS and Beta tapes, which means the quality would be limited to about 240P digitizing it wouldn't increase that.  I doubt much of this footage exists on film, which is what is needed for the serious HD upgrades and that sort of thing.  You can bake tapes and do all sorts of other things to enhance them, but lets be honest about it, none of these bands are The Beatles, and for Bell the juice wouldnt be worth the squeeze to really go all out trying to restore the footage.  But like Girl, I'd gladly volunteer time to do this to restore and digitize this footage before it degrades away or is disposed of.  I'd love just to see a list of what they have for Matt, Much was pretty much just following him around for a couple years there.  If you watch the MMM Bio, you see little snippets of 10-30 seconds of footage all from MG's career.  You can bet much more intensive and complete footage from those concerts existed than those few clips used in the the doc, and there is footage from pretty much all eras of MGB and some early MG solo footage.  For people like us, it'd be a real treasure trove.

 

Would be amazing for sure. We’re certainly not entitled to anything but it is frustrating it sits there. Adam can you take an alternate route and possibly find your way in through the ventilation system haha.

[adam_777]

Would be amazing for sure. We’re certainly not entitled to anything but it is frustrating it sits there. Adam can you take an alternate route and possibly find your way in through the ventilation system haha.

I have tried pretty hard throughout the years to get information or access to this stuff.  I kid you not I've gone through the credits of MG broadcasts on MUCH and searched names and messaged anyone I could find asking if they had any info on who to contact in regards to those archives.  I didnt want some auto response thing.  Someone is employed out there as a caretaker of those archives, I'd love to know who.  But everyone I contacted either long ago stopped working for MUCH or werent going to tell me anything.  Its not Area 51! It's a music and video library.  I just don't get it.  I've had tremendous success in other areas of interest in gaining access to massive archives of material including collections owned by the NHL and Hockey Hall of fame.  And yet MUCH's archive is like Alcatraz. It's beyond frustrating because most of that stuff is of such a niche interest that it so easily could be considered invaluable and disposed of in a landfill.  I know there isn't that many people left that would truly appreciate it, but for the few that are it would mean an immeasurable amount.  I'd be willing to book a months holidays from work, fly to Toronto on my own dime, and do the work making digital copies free of charge as long as I could find somewhere to stay while I was there haha.  I really want this stuff that badly.  

[Guest girl]

And yet MUCH's archive is like Alcatraz. It's beyond frustrating because most of that stuff is of such a niche interest that it so easily could be considered invaluable and disposed of in a landfill.  I know there isn't that many people left that would truly appreciate it, but for the few that are it would mean an immeasurable amount.  I'd be willing to book a months holidays from work, fly to Toronto on my own dime, and do the work making digital copies free of charge as long as I could find somewhere to stay while I was there haha.  I really want this stuff that badly.  

 

I agree with you 100%. I would love to see great quality music footage. Watching Much Music TV footage taped from a VCR recorder with all the commercials, bad sound and graininess doesn't cut it.

 

Why don't you try the lady who did the interview in the clip above? She was actually there in the MUCH library. She might have some connections. She seems like a nice person.

Edited February 7, 2018 by girl

[daniel_v]

I have tried pretty hard throughout the years to get information or access to this stuff.  I kid you not I've gone through the credits of MG broadcasts on MUCH and searched names and messaged anyone I could find asking if they had any info on who to contact in regards to those archives.  I didnt want some auto response thing.  Someone is employed out there as a caretaker of those archives, I'd love to know who.  But everyone I contacted either long ago stopped working for MUCH or werent going to tell me anything.  Its not Area 51! It's a music and video library.  I just don't get it.  I've had tremendous success in other areas of interest in gaining access to massive archives of material including collections owned by the NHL and Hockey Hall of fame.  And yet MUCH's archive is like Alcatraz. It's beyond frustrating because most of that stuff is of such a niche interest that it so easily could be considered invaluable and disposed of in a landfill.  I know there isn't that many people left that would truly appreciate it, but for the few that are it would mean an immeasurable amount.  I'd be willing to book a months holidays from work, fly to Toronto on my own dime, and do the work making digital copies free of charge as long as I could find somewhere to stay while I was there haha.  I really want this stuff that badly.  

Wow, good on you, man. Thanks for at least putting in the effort. I think a lot of us definitely feel the same way.

 

Even if worse came to worse and they were only willing to give a days worth of access to the archives to someone even a phone video just filming the TV it was playing on in the archives would be better than nothing. I did that with a couple old VHS interviews I had from Much Music with Matt that I thought were worth uploading before the quality degraded any further. It's not great quality but it's still nice to be able to view none the less:

 

 

I agree with you 100%. I would love to see great quality music footage. Watching Much Music TV footage taped from a VCR recorder with all the commercials, bad sound and graininess doesn't cut it.

 

Why don't you try the lady who did the interview in the clip above? She was actually there in the MUCH library. She might have some connections. She seems like a nice person.

 

Her name is Anne-Marie Mediwake. If anyone wants to give it a go they can do so here: https://twitter.com/AnneMarieAMK?lang=en

 

The original posted clip on Twitter is here: https://twitter.com/YourMorning/status/958825971511050240

 

 

Edited February 7, 2018 by daniel_v

[Guest girl]

Even if worse came to worse and they were only willing to give a days worth of access to the archives to someone even a phone video just filming the TV it was playing on in the archives would be better than nothing. I did that with a couple old VHS interviews I had from Much Music with Matt that I thought were worth uploading before the quality degraded any further. It's not great quality but it's still nice to be able to view none the less

 

I remember seeing that interview on Much. That brings back good memories. There was also a time when he re-enacted a talking tennis ball and had a run-in with Ed the Sock. I miss the old days of Much Music and MuchMoreMusic. I never watch Much Music now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-mCtb61H88&feature=youtu.be&t=148

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X33u45mBQCk

Edited February 8, 2018 by girl

[foats]

Hey guys,

 

You want some awesome vintage pro shot olp.  Go over to youtube and search "Our Lady Peace @CBGB"  Pro shot Clumsy era show for you.  I tried copying and pasting the link but for some reason it wouldn't work.  Awesome show, perfect quality for this era too.

[Stwlegend]

Hey guys,

 

You want some awesome vintage pro shot olp. Go over to youtube and search "Our Lady Peace @CBGB" Pro shot Clumsy era show for you. I tried copying and pasting the link but for some reason it wouldn't work. Awesome show, perfect quality for this era too.

Whoa was that a great watch. Put it on in the background and immediately stopped everything to watch it. Audio and visually amazing for ‘97. Love the small stage too. Could go on about this, really thanks for the heads up.

[uglyredhonda]

I've never really understood the cloak and dagger approach they take with this.  They've determined Canadians want reality TV on their music stations instead of music.  But why just sit on that massive archive doing nothing? Do they think there is some big cash in down the road?

 

The real problem is that there really isn't any money to be made off of their archive. MTV (US) digitized most of their extensive archive in the early 2000s, but the website they built to host those videos was eventually shut down. There just wasn't enough revenue to justify it's existence and maintenance - especially after bands and labels started signing streaming-exclusivity deals for regular music videos with Vevo. People were going to YouTube/Vevo for videos - even MTV eventually shifted to putting stuff on YouTube themselves.

 

I would hope that Bell wouldn't simply throw it in the garbage. If anything, they could easily donate it to Library and Archives Canada - I'd like to think there would be enough heritage content to warrant its preservation. If LAC didn't want it, I'd hope that some kind of non-profit could establish itself to cover the digitization and preservation of video content (if something like that doesn't already exist). It's likely that whoever got the videos (be it LAC or someone else) would not be able to distribute it at all. But at least it'd be available somewhere.

 

One of the problems that MTV ran into in their process was the rights issues for what they had. For example, in the 90s, bands used to perform multiple songs live for eventual air on MTV's alternative program 120 Minutes, but not all of their performances were aired. And the releases arranged between MTV and the bands/labels didn't cover online streaming (which was in its infancy), and sometimes limited broadcast to a single airing. When MTV digitized their archive and started streaming everything a few years ago - some performances quickly disappeared, including a handful of unaired performances that MTV apparently didn't have / couldn't get permission to stream.

Edited February 10, 2018 by uglyredhonda

[Guest girl]

You want some awesome vintage pro shot olp.  Go over to youtube and search "Our Lady Peace @CBGB"  Pro shot Clumsy era show for you.  I tried copying and pasting the link but for some reason it wouldn't work.  Awesome show, perfect quality for this era too.

 

You sure are good at finding rare concert gems. That was pure rock and roll in its rawest form. I enjoyed watching that. That Car Crash song was really cool. It was different. I've never heard anything like that before. Raine kind of looks like Jarod Leto of Thirty Seconds to Mars there. I look forward to seeing them in concert next month.

Edited February 10, 2018 by girl

[AnythingYouWant]

Nope girl, sorry, Naveed/Clumsy era Raine looks like Jim Carrey, especially in the Naveed video.  And big thanks to foats for the CBGB find!

[foats]

I actually met Jared Leto when 30 secs opened for OLP in Buffalo at the Flickenger Center during the gravity tour. We chatted for about 20 mins. He was kind of prickish until I was able to prove that I owned his bands cd. He signed his autograph as the symbol that the band members use instead of writing his name. This was back when Jared actually sang during their live show instead of having the crowd sing 90 % of every song.

[andydanger85]

I actually met Jared Leto when 30 secs opened for OLP in Buffalo at the Flickenger Center during the gravity tour. We chatted for about 20 mins. He was kind of prickish until I was able to prove that I owned his bands cd. He signed his autograph as the symbol that the band members use instead of writing his name. This was back when Jared actually sang during their live show instead of having the crowd sing 90 % of every song.

 

 

Can confirm the 90% crowd singing thing. I was excited to see them open up for Muse this past summer, and disappointed when it was just him dancing around in a $3000 Versace robe sticking the mic stand up in the air for the audience can sing. They allegedly recorded the audience to include in the single for Walk on Water and he was legitimately mad that the crowd wasn't louder.

[foats]

Can confirm the 90% crowd singing thing. I was excited to see them open up for Muse this past summer, and disappointed when it was just him dancing around in a $3000 Versace robe sticking the mic stand up in the air for the audience can sing. They allegedly recorded the audience to include in the single for Walk on Water and he was legitimately mad that the crowd wasn't louder.

he's done this on every single show since their 2009/2010 tour maybe earlier. I have seen them live 4 times,  the first 2 were great and the last 2 were basically crowd sing alongs.  Sorry if I wanted to sing I'd do karaoke.  Youtube liveshows from them and you can see what I mean.  He also randomly gets pissed at one person every show for not being loud or clapping. I think it's staged because he literally does it every show. The band used to stop mid song for him to rant. It's a shame and makes me wonder if his voice is totally shot now.

[andydanger85]

he's done this on every single show since their 2009/2010 tour maybe earlier. I have seen them live 4 times,  the first 2 were great and the last 2 were basically crowd sing alongs.  Sorry if I wanted to sing I'd do karaoke.  Youtube liveshows from them and you can see what I mean.  He also randomly gets pissed at one person every show for not being loud or clapping. I think it's staged because he literally does it every show. The band used to stop mid song for him to rant. It's a shame and makes me wonder if his voice is totally shot now.

 

 

It's a possibility he's just got a big head, though. That band has always been a little bit overwrought. I think he thinks they're bigger than they are, and I think he thinks that they're so good that they'd be just as popular/famous without a major Hollywood actor as their lead singer.

Edited February 14, 2018 by andydanger85