Target: Iran

[pearanoid]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4252019.stm

 

So now the US, along with others, is putting pressure on Iran to stop nuclear work, which they flat out refuse. Maybe it's a valid concern, or maybe it's another WMD?

 

Disucss.

[wonks]

while I agree that one middle eastern nation having a bomb is not a great idea, it seems to me that the Yanks just want to make sure that they are the only country that can turn the middle east into glass.

[saturnine]

if it's not iran, then it'll be south korea. if it isn't south korea, it'll be pakistan. it goes on and on.

[wonks]

uh...pakistan already has nukes.

[saturnine]

i know.. i was implying that those others would be targets instead of iran

[wonks]

I don't think the U.S. would target Pakistan. first of all, Pakistan is an American ally in the "war on terror", secondly, if they did attack Pakistan India would be joining in so quickly it would make your head spin. that would be a very bad development. Pakistan would launch nukes at India, India would launch right back and we'd have a full scale nuclear war with potentially tens of millions of casualties.

[pearanoid]

It's funny how they've just "forgotten" about North Korea. I guess there aren't enough Muslims there. Yeah, cheap shot.

 

But seriously, it's kind of crazy how the US is suddenly taking it upon themselves to try to disarm the whole world, or more specifally the Middle East. The UN works at this in a more peaceful way with long terms plans, but the US just pipes up saying disarm to suffer the consequences. It's fucked.

[saturnine]

I don't think the U.S. would target Pakistan. first of all, Pakistan is an American ally in the "war on terror", secondly, if they did attack Pakistan India would be joining in so quickly it would make your head spin. that would be a very bad development. Pakistan would launch nukes at India, India would launch right back and we'd have a full scale nuclear war with potentially tens of millions of casualties.

and?

 

you almost sound as if you don't think bush would do that

[wonks]

call me naive, but I really don't think his advisors are that stupid.

[saturnine]

oh, right.. because the iraq thing was brilliant

[wonks]

it's not exactly the same situation...

 

Pakistan happens to have a U.S. friendly leader who doesn't torture and kill thousands of his own citizens.

 

whatever your stance on the current situation in Iraq, you have to admit that they're going to be better without Saddam in power.

Edited February 12, 2005 by wonks

[saturnine]

i think they were better with saddam in power than the us is with bush in power

[wonks]

that's an interesting viewpoint...

[rmak]

if it's not iran, then it'll be south korea. if it isn't south korea, it'll be pakistan. it goes on and on.

its not south korea. its north.

[ecnarf]

Whatever happened to Iran's talks with the E.U. about abandoning it's nuclear weapons/nuclear energy program? I thought the EU had succeeded on those talks or something.

 

Either way, we've been down this road before. I saw CNN showing sattelite images of "Iran's Nuclear Program". This can't be good.

[HoboFactory]

These things never end well.

[Daedalus]

The USA will invade Iran, i have no dout about it. North korea on the other hand i think they will leave alone. N. Korea will not hesitate to blow up a million civilians on their own soil to kill off a US unit. In 15 years North Korea will have starved itself to death anyway, no point pissing off all of the asian pacific when nature will take care of it for them.

[HoboFactory]

It's funny how they've just "forgotten" about North Korea.  I guess there aren't enough Muslims there.  Yeah, cheap shot.

You do realize that North Korea is still at war with South Korea, and they have 1.1 million troops stationed at the border, along with artillery batteries and conventional missles that could turn South Korea into a wasteland the second something happened.

And that they've just announced to the world they have nuclear weapons.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/02/1...alks/index.html

[no yu begin wher i end]

The USA will invade Iran, i have no dout about it.

They don't have the military resources to pull off such an operation. I know Iran is right next to Iraq, but if things aren't going to get any better, then the Americans simply won't have enough troops to get things right the first time around. Iran also has an airforce, something Iraq didn't have.

[Daedalus]

Well doing it right the first time would be nice, but i dont think we can hope for that. I dont think anything can stop the USA from invading Iran to some degree in the near future, the USA simply will not allow anyone but themselves to freely persue nuclear weapons(especially in a middle eastern "terror" country), they want them and their allies to be the only ones with an "end world" button. I see that there are two options for the USA if Iraq does not stabalize enough for a partial troop withdraw. 1) The USA drafts people into the army and attacks with reserves 2) They use what they have to spare now taking as many from Iraq as they can and to balance it out send in the full force of their technology and devastate the economy and ifrastructure of Iran by bombing the place to hell killing many many people. Of course even if Iraq does get better there is still the problem of taxing troops for 3 or 4 times their signed on duty, but this would only be imoral and would not really effect the troops all that much. they will be tired and more will die and they will also be upset, but that is about all.

 

Hopefully the USA can find a peaceful solution, but i dout that will be on the top of the list.

[HoboFactory]

The situation's incredibly difficult to really predict, the only thing that's certain is there are more negative potential outcomes than postive ones.

[c_neglia3]

I think to some extent its become trendy to critize American Foreign Policy when it comes to the middle east, and I by no means would want to see that out of fashion. But by the same token muslim leaders running around with nukes shouldn't simply be an oppurtunity to seek out flaws in the American establishment. Sure the US is ripe with nuclear weapons and sure they are hypocritical when it comes to disarmament; however muslim leaders continue to promote a sense of unity amoung their people while secretly also maintaining a hidden agenda abroad. Oppressive governments like those of Iran do not stand for their people and represent a huge discreprancy between the arab nationalism they preach and the foreign attitudes they foster. These governments should not be defended when it becomes convienant.

 

In terms of Iran developing nuclear weapons the only way to discourage this activity is to make an example of oneself i.e. promoting disarmament indicriminately and following UN guidlines and resolutions. Taking a hardline with Iran is exactly the WRONG thing to do. Primarily because it is 3 times the size of Iraq, and their people just might be resentful towards the west for past political intervention. If the world thought Iraq was a humanitarian debacle, an attempted military campaign with Iran would prove many times worse. As a global community, lets try some of that love thy neighbour stuff and extend the olive branch to Iran so that we could work cohesively towards purging nukes from the entire world, and not just selective regions of it.

[pearanoid]

It's funny how they've just "forgotten" about North Korea.  I guess there aren't enough Muslims there.  Yeah, cheap shot.

You do realize that North Korea is still at war with South Korea, and they have 1.1 million troops stationed at the border, along with artillery batteries and conventional missles that could turn South Korea into a wasteland the second something happened.

So you're saying that if the US somehow attacked North Korea, they'd bomb South Korean in retaliation?

 

And I can't say it's a suprise that they've admitted to having nuclear weapons. Nor is it a surprise that North Korea and Iran are worried about the US and unwilling to disarm. They are, after all, what remains of the "Axis Of Evil". I realize that there are other countries involved in the talks, but those countries havne't been responsible for toppling a foreign government on the scale of Iraq lately.

Edited February 12, 2005 by pearanoid

[phantomzero]

It's just the big boys club of school bullies. The few guys who have the nukes now don't want the other children to play with them. It's so childish. The US will probably do something direct with Iran, North Korea however will never be invaded. Unlike the rest of the emerging nuclear powers in the world, North Korea is the only one with the balls to use them, and everybody knows that.

[Cherry Poppin' Daddy]

North Korea should have been invaded long ago, if simply on humanitarian grounds. Kim Jong Il's policies have led to what can only be termed a holocaust. Food goes to the military first, and the population gets what is left. North Korea no longer has the USSR to back it up, and China has moved to distance itself from it. How long should we let this kind of suffering continue?

 

I don't believe North Korea has nuclear weapons. Until they test one, I consider this just another attempt to scare the west into giving concessions at the bargaining table.