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Moonlight_Graham

About That "gomery Report" Thread

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i find it funny or ironic or awesome that, like, there is almost zero discussion about anything in that thread i made.

 

- Does the report just state the obvious & what has been said a thousand times before, therefore there isn't any reason to comment?

 

- Do people not really give a shit?

 

- Do people feel they must read the report itself to make a comment?

 

- Have the Liberals paid everyone on the Bored hush-money?

 

This is the biggest fucking scandal in the history of the country & its hilarious that not even I, the creator of that thread, even bothered to write my opinion of the Gomery Report.

 

Now, to ensure that this thread recieves more posts than the other one, i must state the following:

 

- God doesn't exist

- abortions should be illegal

- The war in Iraq was justified because the U.N. security council voted for it.

- Pot smokers are assholes

- "Suburbia" is an overrated song

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Haha.

I don't know why these threads get so little contribution, but i guess its up to me now...

 

I agree: biggest fucking scandal in Canada's history. I never supported the Liberals, and this is just more evidence why not to. Yet, no matter how much evidence is presented regarding how MONSTROUSLY corrupt, incompentent, and inadequate the Liberal gov't is, the same people will just keeeeeep voting them in again and again and again.....

 

I said a lot about how bad the Liberals are in one of the old threads related to this, but it seems ever people here still blindly support these imbeciles for some reason. I really don't get it.

 

And even though the other parties are themselves not great options, i would GLADLY vote Conservative, NDP, or even Green over Liberal.

 

I came up with an idea a while ago: what if on every election ballot there was an option for "none of the above", and if this option got the majority, the parties would have to pick all new candidates?

 

I know this isn't really supposed to work in our system, as the parties are supposed to be more important than the candidates in theory, but i find a lot of people are more opposed to (for example) Harper than to the Conservatives themselves. And i'm sure people will be able to pick a lot of holes in this idea, but it might potentially have some legitimacy perhaps?

 

And for your last four points:

 

- God doesn't exist [i agree unequivocally, 100%]

 

- abortions should be illegal [except in cases of rape or incest: abortion better be a FUCKING EMERGENCY, last resort measure, otherwise you're just an irresponsible whore (in my humble opinion, of course)]

 

- The war in Iraq was justified because the U.N. security council voted for it. [i would argue that the Security Council voting for it does NOT make it justified, just 'legal' (if that even means anything).

Justified would require the US to actually have honest and good intentions (which i am sure they do not), rather than knowingly "adjusting the facts to fit the policy" to be more conducive to their goal of establishing through force a US-friendly state in the middle east. Oil? Probably. World domination? Likely.]

 

- Pot smokers are assholes [not all of them (example:me), but yes, many are]

 

- "Suburbia" is an overrated song [overrated, perhaps, but still amazing]

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hurray!! a post!

 

And even though the other parties are themselves not great options, i would GLADLY vote Conservative, NDP, or even Green over Liberal.

 

i agree exactly with what you just said. I'm not an NDP guy (actually all the parties suck right now) but i'd risk them inflating my taxes rather than the Liberals just wasting and stealing my.

 

The Liberals have obviously become complacent. When you have people in a position of power for too long they begin to abuse that power.

 

My friend has a job in the government, so i can see why some people like that may vote Liberal. If he votes Conservative, he may find government jobs cut and the useless fodder thrown away (not saying my friend is useless fodder like some gov't workers, he's an economist & is very hardworking unlike some gov't workers).

 

This is the same for other jobs like teachers. They may be scared their jobs may be cut etc.. And immigrants/refugees may be scared policies will be tightened so many their other family members won't get into the country, or they themselves be sent back. And of course, the Liberals give lots of free-bees to lots of people and people don't want that taken away. Like my lazy unemployed uncle. But still, just vote NDP instead.

 

I find the recent Liberal handouts hilarious. They're trying to buy votes again with our money. Bunch of crooks. But polls say people aren't buying it.

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I find it more funny that George W. Bush, and Tony Blair had no trouble getting re-elected in their countries despite the outrage over the Iraq war. While Paul Martin is having difficulties right now over the government losing a few dollars. But it's also sad because people's lives were worth far more than all the money in the world. The Sponsorship Scandal probably could have been swept under the rug and forgotten, but instead Paul Martin wanted to clean up the government, and look how dearly he's paying for it. This gives no government an incentive to ever clean up their house again when something goes terribly wrong either. Yes, what happened was terrible, but if we had the Alliance in during the initial times to the Iraq war, we would be losing a lot more, far more too. If we ever have the N.D.P. in, our economy will probably go to hell. Poor people starve, they are starving, but it could be far worse, a lot worse than it is right now. Everything in politics is a tight-rope walk, always is, always will be.

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I know this isn't really supposed to work in our system, as the parties are supposed to be more important than the candidates in theory, but i find a lot of people are more opposed to (for example) Harper than to the Conservatives themselves. And i'm sure people will be able to pick a lot of holes in this idea, but it might potentially have some legitimacy perhaps?

Not a chance.

 

You're forgetting that the only reason the conservative party exists is to defeat the liberals. That's it. They all combined in a huge orgy of liberal hate and thought they'd gain something from it. And even after the gomery report, their share of the popular vote went down from the previous election (where the alliance+pc vote was tallied together). Now, the old PC party wasn't exactly a conservative party, either, hence the oxymoron - a progressive conservative. The new conservative party? Just plain conservative.

 

And don't forget that I'm not exactly fond of Harper, either, who has his nose placed firmly up George Bush's ass.

 

Also, don't forget that Canada, as a society, is socially liberal. Why the hell do we want a party that includes keeping gays from getting married on their election platform? Bigotry and homophobia is simply unacceptable in a supposedly enlightened society, and shouldn't we expect that of our elected officials?

 

Also, abortion better be 100% legal, otherwise you're just an asshole who thinks that he should have the ability to control other people's lives and a woman's personal decision. You know what they say, though, if men could have abortions, it would have been legal long ago.

Edited by ecnarf
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Matt, the only reason Martin commssioned the Gomery Inquiry was to he and his party's own hide. The Liberals couldn't have swept the scandal under the rug because Canadians and the opposition parties wouldn't have let them. They would have brought down the gov't a long time ago if the Liberals did nothing. If the sponsorship corruption had been made known to Martin but not made public, Martin wouldn't have done anything. There's lots of money waste within this gov't and they never do anything unless its made public.

 

With Iraq, yes i think its valid for people to choose a gov't that steals from them than one that may send their children off to a war they don't agree with. I also think many people would rather have their money stolen from them than their rights stolen away (abortion, gay marriage etc.). With the NDP though, i'd rather lose money from a weaker economy due to poor (but well-meaning) decisions rather than my gov't steal my money, and waste lots more of it. The bottom line for me is that i will not accept a gov't that is horribly corrupt, wasteful, and steals my money. Giving them my vote would be saying its ok and not making them accountable. I'd rather for Marijuana Party or Green etc. etc.

 

supercanuk, i agree about Chretien (as well as his cronies) that they should be punished more severely. In fact i believe we need laws to but these people in jail. Since when can you steal millions of dollars & commit major fraud and not go to jail??

 

ecnarf, i think the Conservative Party is just in the direction that its leader makes it. There are many in the party that don't really like Harper or his direction (since many are PC'ers of course). Harper is much too conservative for the majority of Canadians, and needs to be replaced. Why is that party too stupid to realize this?

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haha yah Graham, i have thought about it, and in fact did the research and if i steal a car i'll probably go away for six years depending on my standing in the community etc. If i steal MILLIONS of dollars and im a member of Canada's elite, i wont spend a day in jail and pay a couple thousand dollars in fines. Its elitism and capitalism at its worst id say. We over criminalize "workers" crimes, and turn a blind eye to white collar crime.

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Svend Robinson of the N.D.P. was a theif and he's planning on running again in the next election, and all he got was community service, so I'm taking it you're not going to vote for him. ;) I think that N.D.P. is not that well meaning, they've been trying to force the current government's hand until the Liberals said no more, and now they're calling an election that Canadians don't want right now. I think the N.D.P. is making many promises right now just to get votes. At one point Layton said the only way the parties could get his support was to let Canadians consider election reform, yet that disappeared as support for it diminished. And the fact of the matter is they supported a government that was just trying to do good, and when the government couldn't do everything they asked they then decide to punish them, where's the justice there? Also I don't think a weaker economy is a good sacrafice because that means the NDP then doesn't have the money to pay for their social programs.

Edited by Matt
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i think the Conservative Party is just in the direction that its leader makes it. There are many in the party that don't really like Harper or his direction (since many are PC'ers of course). Harper is much too conservative for the majority of Canadians, and needs to be replaced. Why is that party too stupid to realize this?

I have no idea. Harper is such a dick. Plus his extreme Christian views influencing his decisions infuriates me.

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ecnarf, i think the Conservative Party is just in the direction that its leader makes it. There are many in the party that don't really like Harper or his direction (since many are PC'ers of course). Harper is much too conservative for the majority of Canadians, and needs to be replaced. Why is that party too stupid to realize this?

All political parties are stupid, when you think about it. Maybe the Conservatives seem moreso stupid now that they have more than the ability to make a serious go at the prime minister's office... but can't.

 

That said, I wouldn't ever vote for Stephen Harper, were I of voting age. I couldn't vote in good conscience for someone so eager to align himself (and, by extension, all of Canada) with George Bush, or who would likely repeal gay marriage. I may be left-wing, but I'm not a particular fan of any major political party, but at the very least, the liberals have managed to do a few good things during this minority, such as that gay marriage law, or producing a budget with a tidy surplus. Not to mention that new health care deal negotiated with the provinces a few months back, even though it definitely needs something more. Of course, they still need to do a hell of a lot more before I could wholeheartedly support them... such as putting some real investment into green energy, which they sorta promised in their election campaign. Or actually putting a little smackdown on George Bush over the softwood lumber issue.

 

And, to get back to the topic, I'm not really sure how I feel about this gomery report. Martin was, after all, exonerated by the initial report, with most of the blame going to a tight ring of ministers back in the Chretien days. Does that mean that the liberals, as a party, are corrupt? Not necessarily, but it definitely raises questions about how fit a party is to govern when its highest ranking members abuse taxpayer money. I'm not opposed to Paul Martin, per se... he made a good finance minister, and has the capability of being a good prime minister (though as it stands, not "great" by any stretch of the imagination). But there's just something that doesn't rest with me about having the same party in office that wasted so much taxpayer money.

 

Personally, I feel a liberal reformation is in order... a new centre-left party that has been purged of the Chretien loyalists who were involved in the adscam while still maintaining a similar socially liberal and economically moderate position on the political spectrum.

 

Hey, a guy can dream, can't he?

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Svend Robinson of the N.D.P. was a theif and he's planning on running again in the next election, and all he got was community service, so I'm taking it you're not going to vote for him. ;) I think that N.D.P. is not that well meaning, they've been trying to force the current government's hand until the Liberals said no more, and now they're calling an election that Canadians don't want right now. I think the N.D.P. is making many promises right now just to get votes. At one point Layton said the only way the parties could get his support was to let Canadians consider election reform, yet that disappeared as support for it diminished. And the fact of the matter is they supported a government that was just trying to do good, and when the government couldn't do everything they asked they then decide to punish them, where's the justice there? Also I don't think a weaker economy is a good sacrafice because that means the NDP then doesn't have the money to pay for their social programs.

I dont believe in government, its one of those if i were to vote things id vote NDP, although i dont think its right to be stealing, didnt he have some sort of nervous breakdown or something? I dunno..

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Every party gives out money for projects before an election, it's stupid not to, for one it helps you get re-elected, two that's usually when there's a lot of extra money lying collecting from whatever they didn't spend on or hadn't had the plans in place to spend on until then. Also, perhaps they underestimate because if they over estimate they'd spend more money than they have. Part of their promise is to keep the budget balanced and it's difficult to do that if you have overspent. Other parties have "liars and theifs" run to, including the NDP. If the NDP is so much more moral why is Svend running again? They want power just as much as the next party as far as I'm concerned.

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1. never in my life have i voted liberal. never will. and everytime "something" happens i pat myself on the back for that. so, here it is:

i told you so.

 

 

2. most people feel like they must read the report itself to comment on it, or at least know more about it than they do. i think that people in general feel helpless to do anything about it. the government are the law makers, right? they're the bosses. the parents. the ones in charge. a lot of people think that all they can do is vote differently in the next election.

 

3. you don't BELIEVE god exists. can't have an argument challenging beliefs if you don't recognize that yours is just that, a belief. prove he/she/it doesn't.

 

4. abortions should be illegal. the chances of a girl/woman becoming pregnant from a rape situation (that is to say any sex in which she feels less than safe) are WAY too slim to justify legalizing it. the majority of abortions are a form of birth control, and a multi-billion dollar industry of selling fetuses.

 

5. i have yet to hear of ANY action the US has taken in iraq that can be called "justified"

 

6. yeah. they are. they pretty much all are.

 

7. i actually quite like suburbia.

 

the end

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1. never in my life have i voted liberal. never will. and everytime "something" happens i pat myself on the back for that. so, here it is:

i told you so.

 

Never have I, in my life, voted Conservative. Never will.

 

So, in retrospect to Brian Mulroney and Mike Harris: I told you so.

 

 

 

Fair enough.

 

3. you don't BELIEVE god exists. can't have an argument challenging beliefs if you don't recognize that yours is just that, a belief. prove he/she/it doesn't.

 

Actually, the debt of proof in this discussion falls on the believer. We do not make any magical claims about supernatural powers existing out there in the universe - you do. You can't put forth an idea and tell us to disprove your idea. You've got to prove it yourself.

 

4. abortions should be illegal. the chances of a girl/woman becoming pregnant from a rape situation (that is to say any sex in which she feels less than safe) are WAY too slim to justify legalizing it. the majority of abortions are a form of birth control, and a multi-billion dollar industry of selling fetuses.

 

Wow, you make me sick. Women do get pregnant from rape, whether or not you want to believe it.

 

Oh, and, may I add, where do you get off thinking that you, or even we as a society, should have the ability to make that decision for a woman?

 

5. i have yet to hear of ANY action the US has taken in iraq that can be called "justified"

 

Quite true.

 

6. yeah. they are. they pretty much all are.

 

Especially when they partake of it in the vicinity of me.

 

7. i actually quite like suburbia.

 

I think teenage girls flock to it in their overdramatic style. It possesses its own quality, but is highly over-rated by the 13 year old teenybopper set.

 

the end

Edited by ecnarf
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Matt,

 

Yeah, a lot of parties do give out handouts before elections, but the Liberals are one of the worst i've seen. The funny thing is though, most of the handouts will be taken back or cancelled after the election if the Liberals win again.

 

As for the budget, the Libs under-estimate the budget simply to make themselves look good, knowing full well that they'll likely have a surplus. Martin did this well when he was Finance Minister. If you end up with a surplus you look like a very responsible gov't, if you end up overbudget you don't look as hot. Its similar in business, as large companies tend to be more conservative in their earning estimates for their stockholders because if they make more than expected it looks good for the company, but if they make less it makes it seem like the company may be in some trouble.

 

In terms of liars, yeah politicians are all a bunch of liars in some form. But some are worse than others. Take Dalton McGuinty and Mike Harris. McGuinty said on his network TV commercials when running for Ontario Premier that he "won't cut taxes, but won't raise them either", but then the 1st thing he does when elected was raise taxes. Then look at Mike Harris. He said in his campaign what he was going to do, & then we he got elected he did it...and everyone got PO'd !?!

 

Also, with the NDP Svend guy, yeah he stole something. It was a ring, not hundreds of millions of our tax dollars. And he then confessed to it on his own (if i remember correctly) & was crying and obviously felt like shit. Had some sort of emotional breakdown or something. Now that isn't good either, but at least he freely admitted it & apoligized for it. I can forgive someone like that (maybe i wouldn't vote for them), but can't forgive someone like Chretien or countless other crooked politicians who only regret getting caught.

 

Don't know why you are defending the Liberals so strongly. You'll find corruption, power-grabbing, & greed in any party, but the Liberals take it to the extreme & to a point well beyond acceptable.

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4. abortions should be illegal. the chances of a girl/woman becoming pregnant from a rape situation (that is to say any sex in which she feels less than safe) are WAY too slim to justify legalizing it. the majority of abortions are a form of birth control, and a multi-billion dollar industry of selling fetuses.

 

Wow, you make me sick. Women do get pregnant from rape, whether or not you want to believe it.

 

Oh, and, may I add, where do you get off thinking that you, or even we as a society, should have the ability to make that decision for a woman?

 

 

 

- i didn't say they DON'T get pregnant, i said that the percentage of women who become pregnant from rape is too small to justify legalizing it for everyone.

 

"one of the most important reasons why a rape victim rarely gets pregnant, is psychic trauma. Every woman is aware that stress and emotional factors can alter her menstrual cycle. To get pregnant and stay pregnant, a woman

Edited by josiegross
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Matt,

 

Yeah, a lot of parties do give out handouts before elections, but the Liberals are one of the worst i've seen. The funny thing is though, most of the handouts will be taken back or cancelled after the election if the Liberals win again.

 

As for the budget, the Libs under-estimate the budget simply to make themselves look good, knowing full well that they'll likely have a surplus. Martin did this well when he was Finance Minister. If you end up with a surplus you look like a very responsible gov't, if you end up overbudget you don't look as hot. Its similar in business, as large companies tend to be more conservative in their earning estimates for their stockholders because if they make more than expected it looks good for the company, but if they make less it makes it seem like the company may be in some trouble.

 

In terms of liars, yeah politicians are all a bunch of liars in some form. But some are worse than others. Take Dalton McGuinty and Mike Harris. McGuinty said on his network TV commercials when running for Ontario Premier that he "won't cut taxes, but won't raise them either", but then the 1st thing he does when elected was raise taxes. Then look at Mike Harris. He said in his campaign what he was going to do, & then we he got elected he did it...and everyone got PO'd !?!

 

Also, with the NDP Svend guy, yeah he stole something. It was a ring, not hundreds of millions of our tax dollars. And he then confessed to it on his own (if i remember correctly) & was crying and obviously felt like shit. Had some sort of emotional breakdown or something. Now that isn't good either, but at least he freely admitted it & apoligized for it. I can forgive someone like that (maybe i wouldn't vote for them), but can't forgive someone like Chretien or countless other crooked politicians who only regret getting caught.

 

Don't know why you are defending the Liberals so strongly. You'll find corruption, power-grabbing, & greed in any party, but the Liberals take it to the extreme & to a point well beyond acceptable.

Actually, I think they'd have to pull through with quite a bit of this, like the Air India Inquiry, and what not. And Business, sometimes over estimate, like Nortel did, and Apple did this year. It happens, however, it would be bad for a government who promised balanced budgets to overspend which could happen if they spread themselves to thin.

 

Svend Robinson was already being investigated I believe when he admitted he stole something. However, an expensive ring can lead to millions of dollars too, he's a theif, I can't see how you can make an exception for a party you support after you couldn't for one you cannot. Seems a bit hypocritical to me.

 

Also, the eighties P.C.'s were not so glamourous, they were ousted out of office by the Liberals in 1993. That's why the Liberals have been in power for so long, combined with the Reform being too right wing too of course.

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4. abortions should be illegal. the chances of a girl/woman becoming pregnant from a rape situation (that is to say any sex in which she feels less than safe) are WAY too slim to justify legalizing it. the majority of abortions are a form of birth control, and a multi-billion dollar industry of selling fetuses.

 

Wow, you make me sick. Women do get pregnant from rape, whether or not you want to believe it.

 

Oh, and, may I add, where do you get off thinking that you, or even we as a society, should have the ability to make that decision for a woman?

 

 

 

- i didn't say they DON'T get pregnant, i said that the percentage of women who become pregnant from rape is too small to justify legalizing it for everyone.

 

"one of the most important reasons why a rape victim rarely gets pregnant, is psychic trauma. Every woman is aware that stress and emotional factors can alter her menstrual cycle. To get pregnant and stay pregnant, a woman

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Abortion is about far more than birth control. It's about keeping women from potentially ruining their lives. Having a kid is no easy task, and raising that kid for the rest of your life? I don't buy it. And on top of that, you also think that women should have to suffer for a crime committed to them! Carry a child for nine months because some pathetic excuse for a human being wanted to get his rocks off just because a man of power entirely disconnected from your life says so. I find that entirely disrespectful of women, controlling their bodies and treating them like children who are incapable of making their own decisions without the enlightened insight of a man.

 

Furthermore, the whole idea that women should have to suffer for nine months, give birth to the child and then give it up for adoption is even more ridiculous. Why should someone have to bring another child into the world that may likely end up in the foster system until they're 18 and then let them go? In the US, almost 50 million abortions have taken place since it was legalized, and that's almost twice the population of Canada. You try telling me that 50 million people could be accepted into the foster system. And on top of that, I think that it turns women's uterae and children into a tradable commodity. You know, if a woman finds herself pregnant, she can just carry for nine months and dump it off on someone else? That's not the way equals are treated.

1. did you even READ my last post?

 

2. please don't preach to me about whether or not men should be allowed to control the lives of women, about gender equality or any of that crap.

-i'm a twenty four year old female

-i'm old enough to have seen the results of legalized abortion within my own life and within my peer group

-i'm on the "girl" side of the argument, and i'm actually a bit of a feminist

-i come from a long line of rape victims. IN FACT: pregnant rape victims! my great great great (i believe it's three greats. i don't feel like doing the math to make sure. the point stays the same) grandmother was one of many native canadian sex slaves to a group of european immigrants. that means i am a product of rape.

 

i agree that no one has the right to tell you what you can and cannot do with your own body, so let's let these children grow enough to answer the question of whether or not we can tear their bodies limb from limb.

 

sometimes the right thing to do isn't easy. of those 50 million abortions how many are you telling me were products of rape?

 

don't tell me abortion isn't used as a form of birth control. i know girls who's bodies will no longer make babies because of the number of abortions they've had. i know girls who have had abortions and have never regretted it. i know girls who have taken responsibility for thier actions and raised a baby when they were 17 years old. my favorite kid in the whole world was born when her mother was 18, in no romantic relationship and barely on speaking terms with the baby's father! if you have unprotected (or even protected) sex and get HIV what are your options? herpes, what are your options? you don't get to take some morning after pill, or have your HIV surgically removed.

 

abortion may have been intended for "emergencies" but it is no longer regarded that way. how can you think of a baby as merely a part of a certain person's body? your name is adam, so i assume you're a dude. what happens if you knock up your girlfriend? its her choice what she wants to do with it? if she wants an abortion, that's okay, and if she wants to keep it and raise it and take you to court for child support that's okay too?

 

when does a baby stop becoming an appendage of a woman? i think pro choice boys are less about "a woman's right to choose" and more about taking some pressure off of themselves. "oh, it's her body, it's not my responsibility until it comes out" and most of the time, even then, we'll see.

 

 

also, please explain what this means:

I think that it turns women's uterae and children into a tradable commodity.  You know, if a woman finds herself pregnant, she can just carry for nine months and dump it off on someone else?  That's not the way equals are treated.
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Don't know why you are defending the Liberals so strongly. You'll find corruption, power-grabbing, & greed in any party, but the Liberals take it to the extreme & to a point well beyond acceptable.

If you let practically any party have the kind of power the Liberals had for as long as they had it, I'm fairly certain they would become corrupt/drunk with power, too.

 

Would a Conservative minority be a viable alternative? Most people here wouldn't vote for them because Harper...well..."bend me over the table, Georgie!", but if he was accountable to Parliament as a minority leader then would it be as bad as everyone says a Conservative government would be? Just a thought.

 

 

Abortions: Personally, I'm never EVER going to have one.

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Abortion is about far more than birth control.  It's about keeping women from potentially ruining their lives.  Having a kid is no easy task, and raising that kid for the rest of your life?  I don't buy it.  And on top of that, you also think that women should have to suffer for a crime committed to them!  Carry a child for nine months because some pathetic excuse for a human being wanted to get his rocks off just because a man of power entirely disconnected from your life says so.  I find that entirely disrespectful of women, controlling their bodies and treating them like children who are incapable of making their own decisions without the enlightened insight of a man.

 

Furthermore, the whole idea that women should have to suffer for nine months, give birth to the child and then give it up for adoption is even more ridiculous.  Why should someone have to bring another child into the world that may likely end up in the foster system until they're 18 and then let them go?  In the US, almost 50 million abortions have taken place since it was legalized, and that's almost twice the population of Canada.  You try telling me that 50 million people could be accepted into the foster system.  And on top of that, I think that it turns women's uterae and children into a tradable commodity.  You know, if a woman finds herself pregnant, she can just carry for nine months and dump it off on someone else?  That's not the way equals are treated.

1. did you even READ my last post?

 

2. please don't preach to me about whether or not men should be allowed to control the lives of women, about gender equality or any of that crap.

-i'm a twenty four year old female

-i'm old enough to have seen the results of legalized abortion within my own life and within my peer group

-i'm on the "girl" side of the argument, and i'm actually a bit of a feminist

-i come from a long line of rape victims. IN FACT: pregnant rape victims! my great great great (i believe it's three greats. i don't feel like doing the math to make sure. the point stays the same) grandmother was one of many native canadian sex slaves to a group of european immigrants. that means i am a product of rape.

 

i agree that no one has the right to tell you what you can and cannot do with your own body, so let's let these children grow enough to answer the question of whether or not we can tear their bodies limb from limb.

 

sometimes the right thing to do isn't easy. of those 50 million abortions how many are you telling me were products of rape?

 

don't tell me abortion isn't used as a form of birth control. i know girls who's bodies will no longer make babies because of the number of abortions they've had. i know girls who have had abortions and have never regretted it. i know girls who have taken responsibility for thier actions and raised a baby when they were 17 years old. my favorite kid in the whole world was born when her mother was 18, in no romantic relationship and barely on speaking terms with the baby's father! if you have unprotected (or even protected) sex and get HIV what are your options? herpes, what are your options? you don't get to take some morning after pill, or have your HIV surgically removed.

 

abortion may have been intended for "emergencies" but it is no longer regarded that way. how can you think of a baby as merely a part of a certain person's body? your name is adam, so i assume you're a dude. what happens if you knock up your girlfriend? its her choice what she wants to do with it? if she wants an abortion, that's okay, and if she wants to keep it and raise it and take you to court for child support that's okay too?

 

when does a baby stop becoming an appendage of a woman? i think pro choice boys are less about "a woman's right to choose" and more about taking some pressure off of themselves. "oh, it's her body, it's not my responsibility until it comes out" and most of the time, even then, we'll see.

 

 

also, please explain what this means:

I think that it turns women's uterae and children into a tradable commodity.
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