Did Matthew Good Stop Caring About Melodies?

[Guest Bimbly]

It's like he gave up on the music side of things, and he's just wholly into writing lyrics now. Was Dave Genn responsible for making him more musical? That can't be it, he was still interesting through til White Light. Vancouver was a step in the right direction. The Boy Who Could Explode was great, but this Cold Harbour stuff sounds... like his pre-MGB era material, except without anything interesting (the Smiths-esque bass on Last Of The Ghetto Astronauts for instance).

 

ANYONE?! Zero Orchestra (in demo form) might be the most brutal thing he's ever set about to release.

[Manchalivin]

I'll be the other side. Musically, based on the demos of the final songs, this is BY FAR his most interesting album since Avalanche in my opinion and possibly EVER. That's not the same as saying I think it will be my favourite album of his (I doubt Beautiful Midnight and Avalanche will ever be topped, equaled at best, but not topped). I know it's a bold thing to say and much of the music on this is different for MG, but I really think it just fits him right now. I think the opposite of what you said regarding pre-MGB material: there's similarities to it, but unlike most of that, this is very interesting.

 

And while I can understand some people being put off by Zero Orchestra, I think it will just be a temporary shock to some and many will come to appreciate it. I think it's one of the most catchy and unique songs he's ever written and it's not like that song represents the whole album. Just hold out, I think you'll find plenty to like when you hear it complete and give it a chance.

[Gomo]

I haven't heard any of these demos, you guys are just making me more intrigued. I'm a huge fan of the Smashing Pumpkins, a band that pretty much changed their sound through every era (album) in their first 12 years. That said, I appreciate versatility and the ability to "change it up" so I'm looking forward to hearing this new direction from Matt Good. I do know that he got around to using horns and stuff, so that would be cool. I wonder if he'd have a bigger tour budget to include more instruments. My guess is at least a keyboardist.

[OriginalSpecies]

this Cold Harbour stuff sounds... like his pre-MGB era material, except without anything interesting

 

Musically, based on the demos of the final songs, this is BY FAR his most interesting album since Avalanche in my opinion and possibly EVER.

 

I... don't know... what... to think... *screams*

 

Can't wait to hear the new material. I suppose, at the very least, Bimbly's reactions temper my previous excitement...

[Guest Bimbly]

haha of course, it's incredibly subjective as Manchalivin's point of view shows.

 

I just find where he used to do things that were more adventurous or exciting, now his chord progressions and melodies all sound the same. He seems to reject songs that are "catchy" like Bad Pennies in favor of long, languid and arguably just boring songs. It's like the farther away from MGB he gets the more obvious and tired the songs become. I guess you could argue they're "mediative" or something, but man, I'd rather read poetry. That said, Boy Who Could Explode is amazing, Born Losers was catchy, the song Vancouver was wonderful, and the demo of Silent Army was great (why'd he get rid of the great guitar finish though? He neutered the damn thing).

 

I couldn't even finish the Cold Harbour demos I've heard, or whatever he's calling the album. I'm all for change, but to me these songs are just lazy. It's like the melody is totally utilitarian, just meant to service the words. Every new tune sounds so familiar.

 

Meh, I used to love Matt Good and MGB for his music as much as the words. I remember hearing a clip of Sort Of A Protest Song on some Much Music special, the part where the song breaks and goes to that amazing guitar solo in the middle. I was so excited for the record.

 

Don't mind me, just got nostalgic for when I was a devoted fan.

[Gomo]

Just don't get demo-itis.

[Guest Bimbly]

It's like in that song Die Like Kings. The chorus is pretty cool, but he sings it three times essentially the same with no real melodic development. There's room to take it further, but instead it just dies*. There IS interesting discord at 3:16, but the part from 3:32 on (that descending bit) I feel is in like every fourth MG song. Great Whales for sure.

 

*lol

[Manchalivin]

haha of course, it's incredibly subjective as Manchalivin's point of view shows.

Yeah man, it's very subjective. I just find it interesting you mention him seeming to reject songs that are catchy yet Zero Orchestra seems loaded with hooks and catchiness to me. Also Us Remains Impossible from Vancouver, I thought that was catchy. Perhaps in a different way though. He's mentioned something about melody being overused and taking something away from a lot of music (can't think of exactly what he said, I may be a ways off the mark) so it would make sense if you don't find the same melodies you used to in his new music. But I don't think his new music is lazy or tired at all, quite the contrary, I find his new stuff refreshing and really appreciate him challenging himself so much. He seems to be really proud of this new record and said it's the most challenging album he's ever made.

 

To each their own, but fans who haven't heard anything or much from it don't worry, you just may love it. Or you may not. I really look forward to hearing it finished and seeing fans' reactions to this one.

 

It's like in that song Die Like Kings. The chorus is pretty cool, but he sings it three times essentially the same with no real melodic development. There's room to take it further, but instead it just dies*. There IS interesting discord at 3:16, but the part from 3:32 on (that descending bit) I feel is in like every fourth MG song. Great Whales for sure.

 

*lol

Well good news then, Die Like Kings won't be on the album.

 

Just don't get demo-itis.

I really hope I don't get demo-itis with this one.

[OriginalSpecies]

I got demo-itis with Vancouver :/ Took me almost a year to fully appreciate the damn thing (I love it now)...

 

Maybe not being able to listen to these demos is a good thing. Silver lining, I s'pose...

[Guest Bimbly]

Yeah man, it's very subjective. I just find it interesting you mention him seeming to reject songs that are catchy yet Zero Orchestra seems loaded with hooks and catchiness to me. Also Us Remains Impossible from Vancouver, I thought that was catchy. Perhaps in a different way though. He's mentioned something about melody being overused and taking something away from a lot of music (can't think of exactly what he said, I may be a ways off the mark) so it would make sense if you don't find the same melodies you used to in his new music. But I don't think his new music is lazy or tired at all, quite the contrary, I find his new stuff refreshing and really appreciate him challenging himself so much. He seems to be really proud of this new record and said it's the most challenging album he's ever made.

 

MG said melody was overused?! And the guy's a songwriter?! It's not surprising considering his recent output, but man... talk about shocking. What do you find challenging, or interesting about his new music? The addition of horns, or additional orchestration? That in itself might be novel, but the arrangements (at least in the demos) are tired and uninteresting. Zero Orchestra reminds me of Alert Status Red and something else... Black Helicopter? (because it's all like F-Am /Am-F stuff, or whatever key it's in) I don't know Hospital Music very well. All of the songs just sound like rehashes of things he has done before. All of the new songs sound interchangeable with anything on Hospital Music or Vancouver.

 

I'm still curious to hear the final product. haha

[Manchalivin]

Don't quote me on it but I thought it was something to that effect. His favourite record is Laughing Stock by Talk Talk so that may give you an idea of what he's talking about.

 

Anyway, it's too bad you're so disappointed by the new demos. Hopefully the completed album will change your mind. The reason I find these new songs interesting and enjoyable isn't at all just because horns, etc. are included. And nor are their inclusion the only thing that makes this record different but Matthew's vocal approach is different on a lot of songs as well as some of the songwriting. You could add any kind of instruments to a song and it could still come up flat but this isn't boring at all in my opinion. Matthew set out to break out of familiarity with this record and I think he was very successful in fulfilling that goal.

[Vance]

Matt has never put out a bad album. We all have our favorites (mine being AOB) and possibly the odd song that isn't on the top of our list, but I really like every album he's ever put out. That being said (and I haven't heard any demos yet so this isn't judging the album at all), even if this is his worst album ever, it's still gonna be amazing. That's why I'm going to go buy his CD the day it comes out. Nothing MG does sucks.

[saturnine]

i haven't heard any of the demos for this or vancouver and that's why i still rush out and buy the album and take it in for what it's worth. some songs i like, some i don't, but i also don't have 6 months to fall in love or critique certain songs to the point where they become meaningless.

[Manchalivin]

Matt has never put out a bad album. We all have our favorites (mine being AOB) and possibly the odd song that isn't on the top of our list, but I really like every album he's ever put out. That being said (and I haven't heard any demos yet so this isn't judging the album at all), even if this is his worst album ever, it's still gonna be amazing. That's why I'm going to go buy his CD the day it comes out. Nothing MG does sucks.

As a big Matthew Good fan, I don't think you have too much to worry about with this album. Even if some things are a stretch to you I am sure you will find stuff to love about this one. I know the response to the new demos has been highly positive.

 

And Bimbly: Have you heard all the demos? I am curious as to what your thoughts are on What If I Can't See The Stars, Mildred?

[prototypepariah]

I'm not up on the new stuff, but I wonder how having a rugrat to take care of will reflect in his new work? Probably won't be doing a ton of touring anymore. I wonder if he'll make it back to the states, i'm betting no : (

[Guest Bimbly]

I haven't heard many demos, Manchalivin! I have... lets see, Zero Orchestra, Lights of..., Set Me On Fire, Die Like Kings. Send some over, if you'd like.

[Manchalivin]

Oh, well I dunno, maybe you'd rather leave the rest for the completed album? It's up to you, I'm assuming you're an M+ member since you've heard Zero Orchestra? You also can get all the demos from the forums there. I was under the impression you had heard most or all of the demos but you have only heard 3 demos of the actual songs that made the album (Die Like Kings is not on it).

 

Now this is where it's very interesting to me because I wouldn't be too surprised that you find the new material so similar to recent stuff if you had only heard Lights of Endangered Species and Set Me On Fire as they're not too different (especially Set Me On Fire), but I have a hard time grasping any MG fan finding Zero Orchestra anything close to a rehash of other material.

 

I'm not up on the new stuff, but I wonder how having a rugrat to take care of will reflect in his new work? Probably won't be doing a ton of touring anymore. I wonder if he'll make it back to the states, i'm betting no : (

What have you heard of the new stuff?

[Jarrod]

I personally can't wait for the new album. I'm so happy that I haven't heard any new demos for this album. With Vancouver, I had demos for over a year and just listened to them no stop so Vancouver wasn't a huge surprise to me.

 

I love all his music so I'm excited about it.

[Guest Bimbly]

I'm not an M+ member, I did a google search for Zero Orchestra and found it. ;) If you want to send the demos, I'd be happy to check them out. If not, s'all cool.

 

Just to show I'm not above eating my hat, How it Goes sounds pretty good. Just found that one.

[Guest apsham]

I haven't had the chance to hunt down these demos - but damn am I interested in doing so now.

[Manchalivin]

I'm glad this place is getting some more traffic right now. Let's keep it coming. And Bimbly, I'm not trying to be an idiot but I don't think I should share the rest of the album demos with you. I don't know if MG would want that and you'd probably benefit from it anyway when you hear the final album. I'm happy to see you like How It Goes, but regardless of whether they're different or not, you really don't like any of the other ones like Set Me On Fire or Lights...?

[Guest Bimbly]

Set Me On Fire and Lights are boring. How It Goes has been the only interesting one thus far.

[Manchalivin]

SMOF does take a bit to get going but after that I don't find it boring and I just think it and Lights.. are nice. I must say though, musically, I prefer the first version of Lights.. when it was called I Once Saw A Magician Cut You In Half and hope the album version is more like that. It just stood out more and had some nicer melody I think. The guitar sounded so nice in it. Have you heard that one because I could send it to you?

Edited February 26, 2011 by Manchalivin

[Guest Bimbly]

Thanks dude. I actually have Magician, but it's instrumental. It sounds alright, I'd have to hear it with all of the singing over it to properly get a feel for it. I'm particularly interested in Mildred as I've heard some talk of it.

[Computer]

Just wait until you hear the actual album before you make this thread. Boom.