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Israel, Lebanon, Etc Crisis

By HoboFactory, in Politics and Debate: WRONG!

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supercanuk

supercanuk

Posted
Posted (edited)

Designate it's totally fine that we disagree, you're right, you live in Israel, I don't.

 

But that also doesn't mean that I dont know what im talking about ( im not saying that your saying that, for the record).

I have read extensively on this issue and although that means i dont have as much experiance with horrifying conditions of fear, it does allow me a lot of objective analysis.

 

1. "But can you imagine 70 rockets in 24 hours going down on houses and innocent people and the goverment not doing a single thing about it? That's not rational." - No, I cannot say that is rational, however do you think that keeping people under lock down and not allowing them to access food is rational? I know that the Isreali government did this because my family priest (i am an atheist) goes to Israel every year to bring food to these people. I will be joining him next year if all goes to plan.

Do you think occupying other people's land is rational? Do you think that having one of the largest list's of inhumane crimes done against an occupied population is rational?

 

Of course NONE of this is, and we both probably agree, like you said, you disagree with a lot of things your government does.

When it comes down to it, this is very personal, and very real for you, and it isn't at all for any of us. A lot of my family friends are Lebanese and Arab, as well as Jewish, so for me, obviously, I look at this in an entirely different light from a world away.

 

My point basically is, is that this is very real for both Israeli and Palestinian and now Lebanese, and horrific crimes are done to each side, by each side. However, Israel, as an occupying force, under the U.N Charter, and the Geneva Convention, has to to take a sober look at this issue. Who occupied these lands before 1967? This whole issue is about that, and most Palestinians and Israeli's want a two state solution. What needs to begin though, is an antonement ( on both sides ) of past crimes, and some FAIR choices for BOTH sides, neither has really been done for either!

The killing of innocents is ALWAYS deplorable, and whether your Jewish or Muslim you will agree, i personally stick to atheism and it does me just fine!

Edited by supercanuk
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Guest apsham

Guest apsham

Posted
Posted

Maybe they'll finally just kill each other and we can live in peace. [/my grandmother]

 

But either way.. yeah.. I am sensitive to hearing stuff like this, it freaks the hell out of me.

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ecnarf

ecnarf

Posted
Posted (edited)
ELEVEN children and seven adults were killed overnight in southern Lebanon, their bodies consumed by flames when an Israeli warplane opened fire on the convoy they were in, UN peacekeepers and hospital sources said. Their charred remains were extracted from the wreckage of the minibus and car they were travelling in and taken to hospital.

 

A doctor, Ali Zeineddine, said they were burned alive.

 

"It is very difficult to identify the bodies or to distinguish between girls or boys, as the 18 victims perished from the fire triggered by incendiary shells. They grilled," he said.

 

They had been among residents fleeing villages close to the Israeli border and were killed when missiles struck a car and a minibus near Shamaa, hospital sources said. The children were aged between 7 and 12.

 

An officer with the United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL), who was involved in the evacuation operation, told AFP that his team removed most of the burnt bodies.

 

"Some of them were thrown on olive trees and even on haystacks," said the officer, who declined to be named.

 

An AFP correspondent saw the blackened bodies of five of those killed, a father and his four children, at the hospital in Tyre.

 

The father of two of the other children killed, Mahmoud Ghannam, 55, who was not with the targeted convoy, broke down when he arrived at the hospital.

 

"My God, my God. I can't make out the faces of my children. They are burnt black... Which ones are my children?" he cried, repeatedly hitting his head with his hands.

 

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1666361/posts

Edited by ecnarf
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Shiri

Shiri

Posted
Posted

I'd gladly answer all of your questions but I'm afraid I don't have the time to do so right now. I woke up to the sound of loud booms and sirens and spent most of my Sunday morning in the shelter. The rockets have reached Haifa and already killed 8 people. I'll write back when I can.

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Shiri

Shiri

Posted
Posted

Okay, things are relativly quiet now so I have time to answer to your questions. I'll begin by saying that I really hate talk about politics which is why I usually stay around from this section of the Bored, but for some reason I had an urge to comment this time.

 

I know that a lot of people think we were just waiting for a reason to go to war and that our response was too much. But you have realize that those two soldiers being kidnapped aren't the entire reason this whole crisis began, it's just the straw that broke the camel's back. We've been responsing moderatly to a bunch of things that happened by that organization.

 

I don't think Isreael plans to go to war with the whole Middle East. I don't think we'll attack any other country but Lebanon unless they attack us first and then we'll obviously have to response. About seeking peaceful solutions, I honestly have no idea but I don't think there're any negotioations going on at the moment.

 

I certainly don't envy the Lebanese people, obviously they're in worse conditions than we are and I believe they are innocent victims in this exactly like the families that rockets hit their houses in Israel.

 

I just think that watching the news from half a world away tends to make people think in a certain way because it's far away from them and doesn't seem that realistic. I don't expect everyone to agree with me, I totally respect your opinions even if they're different than mine. I just thought I'd give a different point of view you to your discussion. I'm not trying to convince anybody and I don't think I have anything else to say more than I have already.

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Guest apsham

Guest apsham

Posted
Posted (edited)

I agree with you Shiri, I hate seeing people overlook facts sometimes, it's just a major bother. Either way, I hope that you stay safe and sound throughout this. I am sure the whole of the Bored feels this way.

Edited by Apple Shampoo
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ecnarf

ecnarf

Posted
Posted
I'd gladly answer all of your questions but I'm afraid I don't have the time to do so right now. I woke up to the sound of loud booms and sirens and spent most of my Sunday morning in the shelter. The rockets have reached Haifa and already killed 8 people. I'll write back when I can.

Don't get yourself killed. The Bored wouldn't be the Bored without you. ;)

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Guest jsunC

Guest jsunC

Posted
Posted

Stay safe Shiri, and keep us posted. It's really interesting to hear your point of view on this situation.

My prayers go out to you and all of your family/friends.

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Moonlight_Graham

Moonlight_Graham

Posted
Posted
That's no good.

But to be fair, where is the "good" place in Israel to live?

Well nowhere, but where she lives is one of the 3rd largest city in Israel (or something to that effect). This whole thing is fucked up, i'm trying to stay on top of the news but i'm going to have to read up more on the entire background of this conflict (58+ years of history to read - fun!)

 

Designate - i do sometimes wonder what it would be like to live in Israel, & yes i can hardly imagine how scary it would be to live there. In fact i wonder why anyone still lives there at all, i'd get my ass out of there. Israel is really really fucked having so many nations hating you. I said a little prayer for you, so i hope you & everyone will be safe & there's some peace to this crisis sooner rather than later.

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Shiri

Shiri

Posted
Posted

Thanks guys. Today I think there were more rockets than yesterday here in Haifa but no one got killed thankfully. A lot of sirens quite often telling us to go to the shelter. Even one in 6 AM that woke us all up. No one is leaving their homes, I haven't been out since Friday and I'm sooo bored...

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Shiri

Shiri

Posted
Posted

I'm not afraid, I can't really explain it, I suppose I'm pretty indifferent to it. We watch the news on TV a lot but apart from that, we're just living our lives or at least trying to. We can't go outside so the computer keeps me busy. I suppose it's strage, this whole thing is strange.

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