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driftinginfluence

Matt's New Stuff Is Far Too Underated

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Yeah....that was a waste of about, 10 minutes of my precious time that I treasure so much on this board. But seriously though, I can't stand it when people argue like this and make essays of their posts when no one ends up right.

10 minutes? shit, negro, i didn't actually read all those arguments. you mean you did?

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This is far from over.

 

Anyway, for my verficiation, all I meant was Matt Good was trying to avoid any criticism surrounding the change of the album; obviously I can't read the man's mind.

 

Recording an album "live off the floor" is only more difficult because the artist relies very little on post-production editing as they try to "capture" the live environment of the sound. I, for one, am not a supporter of this as downgrading and simplyfing (yes, simplyfing) the music to only attempt to recreate the foundations of past rock & roll acts is a far cry of being anything noteworthy or special.

 

Your comments on lyrics having more importance over the music is very subjective and it's tough to argue something like that. So if a group made an album that was incredibly weak musically but arguably the strongest lyrical material in their discography, would you consider it their strongest effort?

 

Yes, song structures are different from melodies and yes, everything in some shape or form has a melody. This I did not deny. I never said recording feedback was revolutionary but rather it being the true "raw" approach onto things.

 

Alert Status Red IS your straight-forward song musically & lyrically. Now obviously it isn't going to be as cliched as the aforementioned Green Day song but it still follows the current libertarian/socialist beliefs against elitist corporations munipulating underprivileged cultures and societies. There are plenty of songs like that and Matt Good isn't being original at all but he did state strong points that have to be noted.

 

Matt Good being less commercial because of sales is a very ignorant viewpoint. Coming from the age of the Internet, you should know for yourself that ALL RECORD SALES have dropped dramatically since the early 00s and it has progressed even worse come right now. The only artists who still sell records are those who are all over the media spotlight being media & television; Green Day are a fine example. But just because record sales have dropped does not mean that they're less accessible. Matthew Good obviously isn't the cool thing right now and even if he stripped out another Hello Time Bomb, record sales would not make a difference in the mere slightest.

 

That edgy sound from the past is NOT all over the radio right now. The current trend since 2003 is to be independent and have a lo-fi, underproduced sound. Tell me why Modest Mouse have become so popular all of a sudden after making a great record over another? The OC Soundtracks (big time teen-based show) only features bands who attempt at the independent sound with NO edgyness or distortion. Turn on your radio right now; you aren't going to here as much Limp Bizkit, Staind, or Godsmack but rather Modest Mouse, Franz Ferdinand and The White Stripes. Those acts are the trend right now and Matt Good is (can we say subconsciously?) trying to coincide with the create trends in alternative music.

 

Wilco are a commericial group, as they had reasonable success through their entire career and Yankee Hotel Foxtrot has been absolutely praised by critics; everywhere from Pitchfork to Allmusic.

 

 

[i have to go to class so if I don't respond to you, it doesn't mean that "I lost" but rather, I am away from the computer. And sorry I took so long to answer with this message, I was being distracted.]

This isn't an arguement about someone winning or losing, for me anyways, its about stating your opinion, whatever that may be. If you think your winning, congratualtions, this is my last post regarding this because frankly there isn't much else to say.

 

You say that "Recording an album "live off the floor" is only more difficult because the artist relies very little on post-production editing as they try to "capture" the live environment of the sound". Question #1 - are you are musician and could you play guitar and sing at the same time (he did this on some tracks) in a limited number of takes while every other artist records 500 takes and splices the best parts of each take together and throws Auto-Tune on their as well? If you haven't done this, then you don't know. It is way harder to get a polished sound doing it the old school way, multitrack recording is far too easy. The truth is that to do this live off the floor method successfully, you have to be tight as a band and be very talented. Matt said Avalanche was a tedious affair and the White Light sessions were getting back to just enjoying music. If your not a musician, you cannot understand this. You've also got to remember, Matt only started playing guitar when he was 20, and never played lead until Avalanche. He has a such a burden in terms of workload when he makes an record, he has little help, and he thrives this way, pulling out excellent work while doing all of the songwriting himself.

 

"obviously I can't read the man's mind", thank you thats what I wondered. No proof = lack of point.

 

Yes the idead that lyrics are more important is a subjective

one, one that I support, to an extent, I obviously meant that there are limits to this, you can't just be aan amazing poet and write the most intelligent words then throw a chord progression behind it, take what I said with a grain of salt.

 

Regardign feedback, I'm also positive Matt has it on every record he's ever made and is he then just follwing bands like Sonic Youth, hardly,its a great effect, everyone and their dog employs it, nothing more to say.

 

I don't care what you say, there is no strength in the argument that Alert Status Red is a straighforward song lyrically compared to that which is on the radio, far from it. As far as "libertarian/socialist beliefs" are concerned, they are not a new trend as you stated, look at history, they have been around for quite awhile, and the reason they are popular now is the same reason they have always been popular, people don't like to be exploited and enjoy social programs, there have been countless revolutions throughout history that exploit this, its nothing new and not somethign that is a bandwagon to be jumped upon. Again< i never stated that Matt Good was making musical history with WLRRR, i have repeatedly said, which you choose to ignore, that I just think its a great album, with excellent songs, and lyrics which are different from the majority of music on the radio.

 

I don't think that believing "Matt Good being less commercial because of sales is a very ignorant viewpoint" at all. Like I said, he could have made a record much more commercial than WLRRR, but he didn't.

 

Wilco have had great success, but it hasn't been on the radio. Ask anyone who listens to the radio, are they ever on there? Not on any major radio stations thats for sure. And just because critics have hailed them, doesn't mean that the public likes them. They have not won any major awards and even lost in the running for the shortlist prize, so I don't see them as a commercial band. Selling records is not a problem anyway, nothing wrong with financial success, as long as you don't alter your art to achieve this, which you you seem to think Matt has done. And that's where I think your wrong.

 

Thats the end of that, you fail to make any points which have any proof,

This isn't going to you but to everyone else. "Matt Good is trying to coincide with the CREATE trends of alternative music." I have no idea why I used the word "create" but someone still managed to agree with me; I obviously meant to use "current".

 

 

Anyway, I'll try to keep this more short and sweet. Just because someone isn't a musician doesn't mean that they don't have a greater amount of musical theory/knowledge over someone who was gifted enough to have excellent hand co-ordination. That's an unfair & totally irrelevant opinion of yours and it will be dismissed.

 

This isn't a debate; it's a discussion. Who says that we need proof in relation to what Matt Good is thinking? Oh please.

 

Everything else you've said doesn't interest me. But I still find out funny that you honestly believe that White Light was a less commercial album than its predecessors.

 

Oh, one last thing. Wilco have not won any major awards and even lost in the running for the shortlist prize? Really? Then why is it that Wilco won at The Grammys for Best Alternative Album in 2005 for "A Ghost In Born"?

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This is far from over.

 

Anyway, for my verficiation, all I meant was Matt Good was trying to avoid any criticism surrounding the change of the album; obviously I can't read the man's mind.

 

Recording an album "live off the floor" is only more difficult because the artist relies very little on post-production editing as they try to "capture" the live environment of the sound. I, for one, am not a supporter of this as downgrading and simplyfing (yes, simplyfing) the music to only attempt to recreate the foundations of past rock & roll acts is a far cry of being anything noteworthy or special.

 

Your comments on lyrics having more importance over the music is very subjective and it's tough to argue something like that. So if a group made an album that was incredibly weak musically but arguably the strongest lyrical material in their discography, would you consider it their strongest effort?

 

Yes, song structures are different from melodies and yes, everything in some shape or form has a melody. This I did not deny. I never said recording feedback was revolutionary but rather it being the true "raw" approach onto things.

 

Alert Status Red IS your straight-forward song musically & lyrically. Now obviously it isn't going to be as cliched as the aforementioned Green Day song but it still follows the current libertarian/socialist beliefs against elitist corporations munipulating underprivileged cultures and societies. There are plenty of songs like that and Matt Good isn't being original at all but he did state strong points that have to be noted.

 

Matt Good being less commercial because of sales is a very ignorant viewpoint. Coming from the age of the Internet, you should know for yourself that ALL RECORD SALES have dropped dramatically since the early 00s and it has progressed even worse come right now. The only artists who still sell records are those who are all over the media spotlight being media & television; Green Day are a fine example. But just because record sales have dropped does not mean that they're less accessible. Matthew Good obviously isn't the cool thing right now and even if he stripped out another Hello Time Bomb, record sales would not make a difference in the mere slightest.

 

That edgy sound from the past is NOT all over the radio right now. The current trend since 2003 is to be independent and have a lo-fi, underproduced sound. Tell me why Modest Mouse have become so popular all of a sudden after making a great record over another? The OC Soundtracks (big time teen-based show) only features bands who attempt at the independent sound with NO edgyness or distortion. Turn on your radio right now; you aren't going to here as much Limp Bizkit, Staind, or Godsmack but rather Modest Mouse, Franz Ferdinand and The White Stripes. Those acts are the trend right now and Matt Good is (can we say subconsciously?) trying to coincide with the create trends in alternative music.

 

Wilco are a commericial group, as they had reasonable success through their entire career and Yankee Hotel Foxtrot has been absolutely praised by critics; everywhere from Pitchfork to Allmusic.

 

 

[i have to go to class so if I don't respond to you, it doesn't mean that "I lost" but rather, I am away from the computer. And sorry I took so long to answer with this message, I was being distracted.]

This isn't an arguement about someone winning or losing, for me anyways, its about stating your opinion, whatever that may be. If you think your winning, congratualtions, this is my last post regarding this because frankly there isn't much else to say.

 

You say that "Recording an album "live off the floor" is only more difficult because the artist relies very little on post-production editing as they try to "capture" the live environment of the sound". Question #1 - are you are musician and could you play guitar and sing at the same time (he did this on some tracks) in a limited number of takes while every other artist records 500 takes and splices the best parts of each take together and throws Auto-Tune on their as well? If you haven't done this, then you don't know. It is way harder to get a polished sound doing it the old school way, multitrack recording is far too easy. The truth is that to do this live off the floor method successfully, you have to be tight as a band and be very talented. Matt said Avalanche was a tedious affair and the White Light sessions were getting back to just enjoying music. If your not a musician, you cannot understand this. You've also got to remember, Matt only started playing guitar when he was 20, and never played lead until Avalanche. He has a such a burden in terms of workload when he makes an record, he has little help, and he thrives this way, pulling out excellent work while doing all of the songwriting himself.

 

"obviously I can't read the man's mind", thank you thats what I wondered. No proof = lack of point.

 

Yes the idead that lyrics are more important is a subjective

one, one that I support, to an extent, I obviously meant that there are limits to this, you can't just be aan amazing poet and write the most intelligent words then throw a chord progression behind it, take what I said with a grain of salt.

 

Regardign feedback, I'm also positive Matt has it on every record he's ever made and is he then just follwing bands like Sonic Youth, hardly,its a great effect, everyone and their dog employs it, nothing more to say.

 

I don't care what you say, there is no strength in the argument that Alert Status Red is a straighforward song lyrically compared to that which is on the radio, far from it. As far as "libertarian/socialist beliefs" are concerned, they are not a new trend as you stated, look at history, they have been around for quite awhile, and the reason they are popular now is the same reason they have always been popular, people don't like to be exploited and enjoy social programs, there have been countless revolutions throughout history that exploit this, its nothing new and not somethign that is a bandwagon to be jumped upon. Again< i never stated that Matt Good was making musical history with WLRRR, i have repeatedly said, which you choose to ignore, that I just think its a great album, with excellent songs, and lyrics which are different from the majority of music on the radio.

 

I don't think that believing "Matt Good being less commercial because of sales is a very ignorant viewpoint" at all. Like I said, he could have made a record much more commercial than WLRRR, but he didn't.

 

Wilco have had great success, but it hasn't been on the radio. Ask anyone who listens to the radio, are they ever on there? Not on any major radio stations thats for sure. And just because critics have hailed them, doesn't mean that the public likes them. They have not won any major awards and even lost in the running for the shortlist prize, so I don't see them as a commercial band. Selling records is not a problem anyway, nothing wrong with financial success, as long as you don't alter your art to achieve this, which you you seem to think Matt has done. And that's where I think your wrong.

 

Thats the end of that, you fail to make any points which have any proof,

This isn't going to you but to everyone else. "Matt Good is trying to coincide with the CREATE trends of alternative music." I have no idea why I used the word "create" but someone still managed to agree with me; I obviously meant to use "current".

 

 

Anyway, I'll try to keep this more short and sweet. Just because someone isn't a musician doesn't mean that they don't have a greater amount of musical theory/knowledge over someone who was gifted enough to have excellent hand co-ordination. That's an unfair & totally irrelevant opinion of yours and it will be dismissed.

 

This isn't a debate; it's a discussion. Who says that we need proof in relation to what Matt Good is thinking? Oh please.

 

Everything else you've said doesn't interest me. But I still find out funny that you honestly believe that White Light was a less commercial album than its predecessors.

 

Oh, one last thing. Wilco have not won any major awards and even lost in the running for the shortlist prize? Really? Then why is it that Wilco won at The Grammys for Best Alternative Album in 2005 for "A Ghost In Born"?

when you actually have any understanding of music you may start to talk, you are uneduacated and your arguement has no relevance, you are dismissed. You only want to argue because you have nothing else to do. I like Matthew Good because he is good at what he does, your not. End of discussion. If your not a fan, go elsewhere, you are in no position to comment on musical talent.

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This is far from over.

 

Anyway, for my verficiation, all I meant was Matt Good was trying to avoid any criticism surrounding the change of the album; obviously I can't read the man's mind.

 

Recording an album "live off the floor" is only more difficult because the artist relies very little on post-production editing as they try to "capture" the live environment of the sound. I, for one, am not a supporter of this as downgrading and simplyfing (yes, simplyfing) the music to only attempt to recreate the foundations of past rock & roll acts is a far cry of being anything noteworthy or special.

 

Your comments on lyrics having more importance over the music is very subjective and it's tough to argue something like that. So if a group made an album that was incredibly weak musically but arguably the strongest lyrical material in their discography, would you consider it their strongest effort?

 

Yes, song structures are different from melodies and yes, everything in some shape or form has a melody. This I did not deny. I never said recording feedback was revolutionary but rather it being the true "raw" approach onto things.

 

Alert Status Red IS your straight-forward song musically & lyrically. Now obviously it isn't going to be as cliched as the aforementioned Green Day song but it still follows the current libertarian/socialist beliefs against elitist corporations munipulating underprivileged cultures and societies. There are plenty of songs like that and Matt Good isn't being original at all but he did state strong points that have to be noted.

 

Matt Good being less commercial because of sales is a very ignorant viewpoint. Coming from the age of the Internet, you should know for yourself that ALL RECORD SALES have dropped dramatically since the early 00s and it has progressed even worse come right now. The only artists who still sell records are those who are all over the media spotlight being media & television; Green Day are a fine example. But just because record sales have dropped does not mean that they're less accessible. Matthew Good obviously isn't the cool thing right now and even if he stripped out another Hello Time Bomb, record sales would not make a difference in the mere slightest.

 

That edgy sound from the past is NOT all over the radio right now. The current trend since 2003 is to be independent and have a lo-fi, underproduced sound. Tell me why Modest Mouse have become so popular all of a sudden after making a great record over another? The OC Soundtracks (big time teen-based show) only features bands who attempt at the independent sound with NO edgyness or distortion. Turn on your radio right now; you aren't going to here as much Limp Bizkit, Staind, or Godsmack but rather Modest Mouse, Franz Ferdinand and The White Stripes. Those acts are the trend right now and Matt Good is (can we say subconsciously?) trying to coincide with the create trends in alternative music.

 

Wilco are a commericial group, as they had reasonable success through their entire career and Yankee Hotel Foxtrot has been absolutely praised by critics; everywhere from Pitchfork to Allmusic.

 

 

[i have to go to class so if I don't respond to you, it doesn't mean that "I lost" but rather, I am away from the computer. And sorry I took so long to answer with this message, I was being distracted.]

This isn't an arguement about someone winning or losing, for me anyways, its about stating your opinion, whatever that may be. If you think your winning, congratualtions, this is my last post regarding this because frankly there isn't much else to say.

 

You say that "Recording an album "live off the floor" is only more difficult because the artist relies very little on post-production editing as they try to "capture" the live environment of the sound". Question #1 - are you are musician and could you play guitar and sing at the same time (he did this on some tracks) in a limited number of takes while every other artist records 500 takes and splices the best parts of each take together and throws Auto-Tune on their as well? If you haven't done this, then you don't know. It is way harder to get a polished sound doing it the old school way, multitrack recording is far too easy. The truth is that to do this live off the floor method successfully, you have to be tight as a band and be very talented. Matt said Avalanche was a tedious affair and the White Light sessions were getting back to just enjoying music. If your not a musician, you cannot understand this. You've also got to remember, Matt only started playing guitar when he was 20, and never played lead until Avalanche. He has a such a burden in terms of workload when he makes an record, he has little help, and he thrives this way, pulling out excellent work while doing all of the songwriting himself.

 

"obviously I can't read the man's mind", thank you thats what I wondered. No proof = lack of point.

 

Yes the idead that lyrics are more important is a subjective

one, one that I support, to an extent, I obviously meant that there are limits to this, you can't just be aan amazing poet and write the most intelligent words then throw a chord progression behind it, take what I said with a grain of salt.

 

Regardign feedback, I'm also positive Matt has it on every record he's ever made and is he then just follwing bands like Sonic Youth, hardly,its a great effect, everyone and their dog employs it, nothing more to say.

 

I don't care what you say, there is no strength in the argument that Alert Status Red is a straighforward song lyrically compared to that which is on the radio, far from it. As far as "libertarian/socialist beliefs" are concerned, they are not a new trend as you stated, look at history, they have been around for quite awhile, and the reason they are popular now is the same reason they have always been popular, people don't like to be exploited and enjoy social programs, there have been countless revolutions throughout history that exploit this, its nothing new and not somethign that is a bandwagon to be jumped upon. Again< i never stated that Matt Good was making musical history with WLRRR, i have repeatedly said, which you choose to ignore, that I just think its a great album, with excellent songs, and lyrics which are different from the majority of music on the radio.

 

I don't think that believing "Matt Good being less commercial because of sales is a very ignorant viewpoint" at all. Like I said, he could have made a record much more commercial than WLRRR, but he didn't.

 

Wilco have had great success, but it hasn't been on the radio. Ask anyone who listens to the radio, are they ever on there? Not on any major radio stations thats for sure. And just because critics have hailed them, doesn't mean that the public likes them. They have not won any major awards and even lost in the running for the shortlist prize, so I don't see them as a commercial band. Selling records is not a problem anyway, nothing wrong with financial success, as long as you don't alter your art to achieve this, which you you seem to think Matt has done. And that's where I think your wrong.

 

Thats the end of that, you fail to make any points which have any proof,

This isn't going to you but to everyone else. "Matt Good is trying to coincide with the CREATE trends of alternative music." I have no idea why I used the word "create" but someone still managed to agree with me; I obviously meant to use "current".

 

 

Anyway, I'll try to keep this more short and sweet. Just because someone isn't a musician doesn't mean that they don't have a greater amount of musical theory/knowledge over someone who was gifted enough to have excellent hand co-ordination. That's an unfair & totally irrelevant opinion of yours and it will be dismissed.

 

This isn't a debate; it's a discussion. Who says that we need proof in relation to what Matt Good is thinking? Oh please.

 

Everything else you've said doesn't interest me. But I still find out funny that you honestly believe that White Light was a less commercial album than its predecessors.

 

Oh, one last thing. Wilco have not won any major awards and even lost in the running for the shortlist prize? Really? Then why is it that Wilco won at The Grammys for Best Alternative Album in 2005 for "A Ghost In Born"?

when you actually have any understanding of music you may start to talk, you are uneduacated and your arguement has no relevance, you are dismissed. You only want to argue because you have nothing else to do. I like Matthew Good because he is good at what he does, your not. End of discussion. If your not a fan, go elsewhere, you are in no position to comment on musical talent.

What's this??

 

I'm not allowed to talk with you because [A] I don't like Matt Good? or I'm not a tremendously multi-talented musician so I can't stay up to par with you?

 

That's pretty sad on your part and if that's the case, then I'm glad that I'm not going to speak with you again.

Edited by Shortcut To Moncton
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no you can't talk becuase you have no argument, you just want to argue so you can argue, get a point then we can talk, your just bashing that's what i was saying.

 

question: if you don't like matt good why are you here?

i'm not a multiskilled musician either i was commenting ont he fact you would not understand the difficulty of recording an album live off the floor, if you don't like WLRRR fine, but don't go off on tangents about it not being a revolutionary record, i don't care i never said it was, you really just want to argue, if you want to bash him cause he's more talented than you, go elsewhere or get a valid argument.People seem to think just becuase you have a right to an opinion means that their opinion is right, if you don't have proof or reasons for something, keep quiet.

That is the end of that.

Edited by driftinginfluence
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no you can't talk becuase you have no argument, you just want to argue so you can argue, get a point then we can talk, your just bashing that's what i was saying.

 

question: if you don't like matt good why are you here?

i'm not a multiskilled musician either i was commenting ont he fact you would not understand the difficulty of recording an album live off the floor, if you don't like WLRRR fine, but don't go off on tangents about it not being a revolutionary record, i don't care i never said it was, you really just want to argue, if you want to bash him cause he's more talented than you, go elsewhere or get a valid argument.People seem to think just becuase you have a right to an opinion means that their opinion is right, if you don't have proof or reasons for something, keep quiet.

That is the end of that.

Find me one line where I actually bashed Matthew Good.

 

I never once stated that you believed that it's a revolutionary album. Not once.

 

You handle criticism so poorly, it's embarassing really. You need to understand that not everyone is going to agree with you and telling them to "go elsewhere or get a valid argument" is a juvenile attempt at avoidance.

 

Well, yes, obviously the man has more talent than me. That was the basis of my argument earlier. With all the potential that he has, why would he want to make such a dumbed-down effort besides the fact of "makin' it live off the floor"?

 

I just love how you are trying to end this conversation after each post when you prove absolutely nothing to me.

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no you can't talk becuase you have no argument, you just want to argue so you can argue, get a point then we can talk, your just bashing that's what i was saying.

 

question: if you don't like matt good why are you here?

i'm not a multiskilled musician either i was commenting ont he fact you would not understand the difficulty of recording an album live off the floor, if you don't like WLRRR fine, but don't go off on tangents about it not being a revolutionary record, i don't care i never said it was, you really just want to argue, if you want to bash him cause he's more talented than you, go elsewhere or get a valid argument.People seem to think just becuase you have a right to an opinion means that their opinion is right, if you don't have proof or reasons for something, keep quiet.

That is the end of that.

Find me one line where I actually bashed Matthew Good.

 

I never once stated that you believed that it's a revolutionary album. Not once.

 

You handle criticism so poorly, it's embarassing really. You need to understand that not everyone is going to agree with you and telling them to "go elsewhere or get a valid argument" is a juvenile attempt at avoidance.

 

Well, yes, obviously the man has more talent than me. That was the basis of my argument earlier. With all the potential that he has, why would he want to make such a dumbed-down effort besides the fact of "makin' it live off the floor"?

 

I just love how you are trying to end this conversation after each post when you prove absolutely nothing to me.

 

your a joke, i can't take criticism? yeah ok, i try to end this becaase you act like an seventh grader, whatever man, get a grip.

and this is not bashing him? I would say it is

"Matt Good was just trying to find an excuse when critics asked him why the album was such a step backwards in the opposite direction. It isn't the most enjoyable album to listen to so its best to crank it up during shows to reach his demographically accessible audience but they won't know the difference."

that is an insult to him as a person, the fact he would make up an excuse for why he did the album that way and the songs he wrote. To say you don't like is work is perfectly allright, but to come out of left field and say he made it to please people and make more money is an uneducated opinion. You know what, you inability to back up anything you say is what's embarrassing,`a "discussion" doesn't mean that you can talk without proof or reason, especially when you say he made an album for certain reasons, you can't possibly justify this. If you can, please do, but I don't think you can.

Edited by driftinginfluence
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I really don't consider that bashing at all. I'm not really bashing the music and calling him OR the music terrible; just that he had to pull some answers out of his sleave after the recording process since it was such a drastic turn musically. No bashing intended.

 

I never said that he wanted more money; just because he is leaning to be more accessible musically doesn't mean that he is craving for cash.

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each album strikes up a very different mood for me... and when I'm in a darker mood, I find I'm more drawn to the MGB stuff, and when I feel lighter MG solo seems to do the trick. All great, but there's a monstrous difference in atmosphere and aesthetic between MGB's work and MG's work

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